Pot Odds Explained -

[Kramer]

I've been here quite a while and never seen a post on
Poker pot Odds so here Goes :


Pot odds explained :

1. A lot of the money to be made in poker comes from players who chase draws in small pots.
Most of the time, draws do not come through, so the money spent on calls is lost.
When a draw hits, there MUST be enough money in the pot to make up for all those times it didn't.

Enter the concept of "pot odds."
The money in the pot must be greater than the odds of completing a draw.
For example, you are on the button and flop an inside straight, 6♥?7♠?_9♣?T♥?. There are three bets in the pot; a bet and a raise make the total six. To chase your draw, you must call two bets. The pot odds are thus 6:2, e.g. 3:1. The chances of completing an inside draw with the next card are 11:1. With pot odds of only 3:1, this is a very unprofitable draw. If you chase hands like that you will leak money like a sieve.
Now let's take the same hand, but with different pot odds. Say there are more people in the pot, and no raise. When it gets to you, there are 13 bets in the pot, and it costs only one to call. Now with pot odds of 13:1, it is a profitable draw.
FYI, here is how the 11:1 odds for an inside draw are derived. In the above hand, only four cards in the deck (the eights) complete a straight. There are 47 unseen cards left in the deck. 4/47= 12 (rounded). So on average, if 12 cards are drawn from the deck, one of them will be your blessed eight. Eleven cards are not eights, one card is an eight, giving odds of 11:1.
A much better draw is an "open ended" straight. Say you flop the hand 6♥?7♠?8♠?9♣?. Now eight cards will help -- the tens and fives. Look down the "outs" column in the chart on the right until you find "8".
If you have eight outs, you need pot odds of only 5:1.

POT ODDS NEEDED TO CALL BY NUMBER OF OUTS :

2 OUTS : 22-1 (I.E. PAIR OF ACES SOMEONE GOES ALL IN)
3 OUTS : 14 : 1
4 OUTS : 11-1
5 OUTS : 8-1
6 OUTS - 7-1
7 OUTS : 6-1
8 OUTS : 5 - 1
9 OUTS : 4-1
10 OUTS : 4-1
11 OUTS : 3-1
12 OUTS : 3-1


Number of Outs Percentage of Hitting on Turn
1 4.4
2 8.4
3 12.5
4 (Inside straight draw) 16.5
5 20.3
6 (Two overs) 24.1
7 27.8
8 (Open ended straight draw) 31.5
9 (Flush draw) 35.0
10 38.4
11 41.7
12 (Flush draw + Gut shot) 45.0
13 48.1
14 51.2
15 (Straight Flush draw) 54.1



The bottom line is This :

The way I see it pot odds indicate always in favor of a monster draw

[Kramer]

Many players mistakenly believe, even some experienced players, that you're wrong to continue in situations where you're not favorite to win. This is usually good advice, but it's advice that doesn't take into account any of the circumstances other than the (current) strength of your hand and what you believe your opponent to hold

When the pot offers you high odds, you don't need to win often,
IS THE LESSON HERE.

Let's turn to an example outside poker, If you and I were betting on the roll of a die, and you bet $1 that it would come up a 6, how much would you need me to pay you if you wanted to make a profit from the bet? Well, my odds of winning are 5:1; there are 5 ways that I can win, and only 1 way that you can win. You need, therefore, odds that are better for you than 5:1. If I pay you $6 when you win, and you pay me $1 when I win, you will show a long-term profit, because if we roll the die 600 times, for example, you will win on average 100 times (100 * $6 = $600) and lose 500 times (500 * $1 = $500). The money that you stand to win, as compared to the amount of money that you need to invest to be able to win them, is what constitutes your pot odds

[Seanie Mac]

make it simple kramer.

if your not getting like 3-1 to hit a draw fold

[Seanie Mac]

as i say that i put a guy all in on my straight flush draw to his K-K getting barely 1.5-1

[dhunter]

Originally Posted by Seanie Mac

as i say that i put a guy all in on my straight flush draw to his K-K getting barely 1.5-1

did it hit?

[Seanie Mac]

na it was a gutshot anyway and board paired on the flop so i was way behind anyway

[Kramer]

Originally Posted by Seanie Mac

make it simple kramer.

if your not getting like 3-1 to hit a draw fold

Pretty simple Mac :

You're in a $5/$ 10 no limit cash hold em game
All check ,
BB $ 50 you SB and everyone folds?
You're last to act .
You both have $ 500 in real money sitting at the table

You can have JJ,QQ,KK,AA
Pretty high Pairs.
No matter what Pair you Have If you both have same amt of chips ,
you should always fold as the pot odds don't justify calling.

However if you have a straight or flush draw , always call.

Many will look at this and say If I have 2 Aces and we both have the same amout of chips why the *** would I fold?

Keep in mind you need 22-1 POT Odds on the long run to win with a pair
(I.E. BB CoulD Be Drawing A Straight/Flush)

[Kramer]

If you've ever watched poker on tv and someone goes all in,
and the caller asks him how much you push in or ask the dealer
how much he went in for
and takes a few minutes ,

What he's doing is figuring out his POT ODDS ...

[jaypasco]

pot oddes is just a myth in poker and real players dont even care

[JohnnySmooth]

Originally Posted by jaypasco

pot oddes is just a myth in poker and real players dont even care

Every pro uses pot odds. Well maybe not Jamie Gold.

[Seanie Mac]

dont listen to jay he just started playing last year

[jaypasco]

Originally Posted by JohnnySmooth

Every pro uses pot odds. Well maybe not Jamie Gold.

when u see them counting the odds in there head there are not really counting and just using that as excuse to call a all in with jq suited. I laugh sometimes when i see them counting

[hammink]

Originally Posted by jaypasco

pot oddes is just a myth in poker and real players dont even care

Pot odds aren't a "myth" but there are winning players out there who don't think about math much at all. So there's some truth in that statement.

Play poker enough and you start to just "get a feel" for what to do in certain situations. In reality, there are all sorts of things going on in your brain to make you get that feeling (mostly memory of past hands but also tells etc.) but the conscious mind just goes with what "feels" like the right play.

That said, usually the ones who get good at poker that way are the degenerate gamblers who have lost a ton of money along the way...

[Kramer]

Originally Posted by jaypasco

pot oddes is just a myth in poker and real players dont even care

yeah kinda like NFC odds ...

[Chicago RED]

1. Pot Odds

*Don’t bet when you can’t make $*

Calculate what’s in the pot, and compare it to the amount to call. The result is your pot odds. If the pot contains $1,500 and it will cost you $500 to call your pot odds are 3 to1.

Expressed odds: Are the odds currently being presented by the pot.

Implied odds: are the odds that the pot will eventually offer after all the betting is done.

Sometimes pot odds will say it is ok to chase a flush or str8 draw, but other things do play a key roll in making a choice to continue in a hand like this. One of the most important being Stack Size. Position & Image can also play factors. But stack size is one of the more important factors when taking a look at pot odds, and if you should chase your draw.

Lets say you buy into a 1/2 NL ring game for $200

3 hands in you are dealt 9c 8c in LP no one re pops so you limp

The Flop: 6c Ac Qh

$6 in the pot so far EP bets $2, MP calls you call

Turn Qd

Ep bets $15 just over pot saying he has trip Q's MP re-pops to $35

Action to you: What do you do?



If you said call you are way off, heres why: 1. The pot odds in this case have turned out of your favor, and with 1 player left to act after you this can be a 3 way all in situation. With a 16.7% chance of you hitting your flush this just turned into a bad hand for you.

2. Stack size you would be hurt if you miss this hand.

Now lets say we take the same situation but insted of you just buying in you have been in the game for 3 hours and have grinded your stack size up to $650 and it is up to you on 4th street, now a call here may not be a bad thing, if you hit you are getting paid if you miss oh well. Even though pot odds still make it incorrect to call, and your hand equity value says FOLD, you still have a choice with your stack size, as for myself this hand would be a easy lay down in both cases.

We have all heard the saying that "there is more to poker then just the cards"
And that statment can not be more true. Just becuse one thing may tell you it is correct to make or chase your hand, be sure to look at the many other things as well before you make your choice, because two other things may say no.

I would never try and make my draw with 100BB behind me. The biggest advice I can give is go for your draws only when you are deep stacked, this will save you more $$$ in the long run, and that is what this game is about. GL RED